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2002 May 21 11:45

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Re: [vox] Stallman on Slashdot
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Re: [vox] Stallman on Slashdot



begin joseph e arruda <zeruch@dibona.com> 
> 
> On Tue, 21 May 2002, Peter Jay Salzman wrote:
> 
> > begin joseph e arruda <zeruch@dibona.com> 
> > > 
> > > It's more of the same drivel RMS spews
> > 
> > drivel?  i'm having a hard time understanding your position.
> 
> You would. You take everything RMS bleats as pure gospel. I don't.  We've
> gone back and forth on this repeatedly, and neither of us is going to
> change on it.
 
gospel?  hardly.  i'd prove it to by showing the lines where i said RMS
is "justified but is way too extreme in his views and words", but
unfortnately, you snipped that part of my email.


but everything you say below, and i'm keeping it for quoting purposes,
really doesn't address anything i said:

1. our systems are just as much GNU as they are linux.

2. RMS is justified in feeling put-off that GNU gets no billing (other
  than debian).

3. his extremism in words and complaints are over-the-top.  when people
  rant like a madman, nobody is going to take them seriously.  he really
  needs to learn that people stopped listening to him long ago.

4. talking about extremism and over-the-top words... your own words,
  imho, are just as outrageous as RMS.  you're two peas in a pod, and
  it's very easy for me to discount your entire email when you say
  things like:

   > He's frustrated because his fucking ego isn't being stroked by the PR
   > equivalent of a buxom 17 year old Britney clone wearing a PVC halter top
   > and an Oral B mint dental floss thong like Linus has.

   heck, in fact, i'd say that it's easier to write you off than it is
   to write off RMS.  at least his insanity *tries* to be civil.  your
   insanity is overshadowed by your propensity to flame the guy.  at
   least RMS would try to debate you.  afaics, you'd just be sitting
   there talking about his personal hygiene.


the entire rest of your email (and i'm keeping it intact for reference)
lambasts the guy on a personal level.  that's fine -- i have no problem
with your opinion of the dude.

again, i'm not advocating we all start caving in to RMS's demands and
start changing what we call "linux".

all i'm saying is:


   regardless of whether his rhetoric is insane or not, i understand his
   position.  i don't necessarily advocate embracing his position.  i
   simply understand his position.


pete

ps- if raster, horms, san mehat and mandrake changed the license of
their software simply because (quote):

      "hey hate stallman's dreck so much they won't even deign to use
      his licenses"
      
and not because:

      "they don't like the terms of the licenses"
      
then that's a testament to their own childish stupidity.   i would hope
they can separate the man from license.


> > the personality of our systems is firmly grounded with the GNU side
> > rather than the linux side.
> 
> The 'personality' of our systems is firmly grounded in the people who
> choose them (or choose to code them) which by and large has ignored the
> pounding-sand rhetoric of little Ricky and his merry band of inane
> sycophants.  
>  
> Even people like Raster, Horms, San Mehat and Mandrake have switched to
> BSD like licenses for their work because they hate Stallmans dreck so much
> they wont even deign to use his licenses.
> 
> > do i care enough to start saying "gnu/linux" everytime i have a
> > conversation with someone?  no.  but calling this point "drivel" is just
> > completely way off mark.  i can understand RMS's frustration.  i'd be
> >  frustrated too.
> 
> He's frustrated because his fucking ego isn't being stroked by the PR
> equivalent of a buxom 17 year old Britney clone wearing a PVC halter top
> and an Oral B mint dental floss thong like Linus has.  He always
> fails to realize the following:
> 
> 1. Linus is approachable, affable and presentable to a general audience (a
> clean, well-kept, well-spoken, family man who happenes to be an uber-geek
> is invariably more photogenic and quotable than an unapproachable,
> irrascible, dirty git with a semantic chip on his shoulder the size of
> Vermont).
> 
> 2. He is so far out too lunch reality-wise that he just refuses to
> understand that the whole world cannot operate (or wants to
> operate) exactly as he does -- not everyone on Earth can survive on
> University grants and donations to our own personal non-profits.
> If he ever had to actually *work* in any other setting, he would be an
> utter abject failure professionally.
> 
> 3. He suffers from the typical academic syndrome of "oh, these people
> disagree with me.  Not because they have a different opinion, but because
> the obviously must be idiots, since they disagree with me, for I am
> intelligent and always right."
> 
> > what do you see are the unanswered/deflected questions?   
> 
> I should have worded this differently, and I'll admit that much.
> 
> It's not like this opinion of RMS is new guys.  I have had it since my
> first encounter with him, and have never seen him do or say anything to
> improve it since...
> 
> z
> 
> _______________________________________________
> vox mailing list
> vox@lists.lugod.org
> http://lists.lugod.org/mailman/listinfo/vox
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